Malcolm Nance Exposes How The Republicans Will Continue Their Treason

They lost the popular vote, lost the electoral vote, and lost much of their own supporters. What they lack they will  try to makeup the difference with denial. The Party of Putin’s Pouters will continue churning out bullshit.

This is all exposed in the next book  by the Resistance author and intelligence expert, Malcolm Nance. He was on the John Aravosis UnPresidented Show to discuss how the right wing is manufacturing fake rebellion pretexts. I  just found out about it from Malcolm’s appearance on the show.

I believe this is how Malcolm’s part in this conversation went. Edited to focus on Malcolm and online text formatting.

Malcolm Nance UnPresidented Show Interview

Malcolm Nance is a former intelligence, author and officer. New York Times best-selling author, MSNBC contributor. His most recent book is the Plot to Betray America, which is now out in paperback.

John Aravosis:
Are you working on anything new?
Malcolm Nance:
Well, you know, in fact I did not ever want to write another book about Trump. I really didn’t. I had three books of the plot series, Plot to Hack America, Plot to Destroy Democracy, and now Plot to Betray America. So people were like, oh, you got to do another one. I’m like no, never again and then, as we were coming into the run-up to the election. I was just seeing so many terrible things that were happening with the way that Trump supporters were starting to talk. They were using what we call Eliminationist rhetoric.
I was just gonna say I’m, not doing another “plot to” book, but it’s a book about right-wing extremism and what I call the coming TITUS. Which is the Trump Insurgency in the United States.
That Donald Trump and his followers are going to be pretty much like Saddam Hussein in Iraq. In 2003. They’re all going to go underground and they’ll do a very low-grade political military insurgency.
John Aravosis:
We just heard, this may have been yesterday. Joe Digenova, one of those lunatic Fox lawyers. Who is on Trump’s side. What do he say? We should execute Chris Krebs, the former head of election security and in homeland security, literally use that phrase.
Malcolm Nance:
Yes. Drawn and quartered, and that he should be taken out at dawn and shot.


John Aravosis:
What do we do with with people like that?
Malcolm Nance:
Well, what you’re watching is something which I saw when the Hutus were about to massacre the Tutsis. In Rwanda, back in the late 1980s, but you know as an intelligence guy. At that time I was actually supporting sub-Saharan African operations and the US embassy down there, and we were seeing what we call eliminationist rhetoric. This is words and behaviors, which are indicating how they’re, viewing their opposition, and in at that time they had their their national radio program channel. [RTLM] State Radio and TV.
Radio talk, which was was saying, you know, your neighbors don’t deserve to live. They’re, not humans. Some type, you know they’re. They’re animals, they’re monkeys, they’re cockroaches.

Cliff Schecter:
Is America unique? Do we not have the threat of the kind of violence we had in Rwanda in America? So I wanted to know what the hell do we do about it?
Malcolm Nance:
I answer the obvious answer that no, America is not like Rawanda and we aren’t going to go out and start massacring our neighbors. I often think back to a period that culminated somewhere around 1860, where in fact we did that very thing. We not only took up arms against each other, all of the American institutions severed and split. Right down to the Commandant of the US Military Academy at West Point.
Colonel Robert E Lee at the time. He left, abandoned his post. Took all the southern soldiers with him and formed an army to commit treason against the Constitution of the United States.
So I can’t say that. Would there ever be a circumstance where this nation would would fracture? But let me tell you something, I know that for a very long time. Oh somewhere, around five years, the media hoi polloi, a lot of them. You know, a lot of the journalists who were Glenn Greenwald followers, and there’s, this whole class of what I call bro journalists, right? Journalist bros, whatever you want to call them. Who became over time, were like the Snowden lover, Assange lover, and the entire Trump-Russia scandal, where you know where Russia actually hacked not just the Democratic Party. But the mindset of the American public, using information warfare as the vehicle to to create a disinformation bubble around America that sucked in 40% of the nation. Then it magnified the insanity from their preferred candidate. For a very long time I had these guys really soundly criticizing me for writing these books. Saying what we all see now or what we were seeing with our very eyes at the time.
Saying things like, oh well, that couldn’t possibly have happened and you’re, a conspiracy theorist. For a very long time we had people calling us conspiracy theorists. Even though I was the first person in US media to call the Russian operation an attack on the United States. In real time, and then two days later, Donald Trump called on Russia to hack and release Hillary’s emails as if to prove it.

Armchair Nay Sayers

We still have these people. I call them Trump-Russia’s deniers. The Trump-Russia truthers. People who are still mainstream journalists but don’t believe that it really happened. Or that it didn’t happen the way people see it.
I have four New York Times bestsellers in a row, but I’m not a journalist. I’m an intelligence officer who is doing analyses and giving you these warnings, way in advance of the news media.
I’m looking for things that that journalists would not be looking for. You guys are looking to have an interview with a guy that will tell you that there’s a pinpoint of light out there.
So what happened with him is he goes. Well, you’re saying that the Russians have a strategy to influence the American minds and said that they could take our population without firing a shot. Interestingly enough, I had said that on on MSNBC with Brian Williams. Then on Fox News, Tucker Carlson, the next night, ridiculed it. As if they had never heard of the Trump Russia scandal.
This is 2019, it was well established, and so I said. Well, the Russians said it.
They’ve done studies of this. They have a doctrine called the jurassimov doctrine, which is the named after the chief of staff of the Russian armed forces. Who actually had a strategy where they said they would use information, the power of the internet, to influence target audiences and populations in such a way that they could remove a nation’s sovereignty without firing a shot.
Yup and so Matt Taibi goes. Where did you get that? Who told you that? Where did you get this?! and I realized. Oh, this was a hostile interview. Go spend $28.95 and you can go buy my book Plot To Destroy Democracy where the Russians pretty much say it outright. He goes no. No, I need your source. You’re coming out and writing this, and I go. There were studies and he goes well. This is like saying the Rand Corporation writes a study and suddenly it’s policy. I go. We’re under attack right now.

John Aravosis:
So let me ask you this. This is the Russian model. If you look at what we know. We look at what they’ve done in France, what they’ve done in the UK. They get these far right figures, who were once on the far left, as well as the far right to come together and support their conspiracies. Is that what we’re, seeing here?
Malcolm Nance:
Yes and the Germans have a name for it. If you read it, the the first real politician from the west, who the Russians did this to. Which essentially bought their loyalty with money with oligarch money. They have a name for it, Schroder-ization. Schroder was not the first one, he is the highest level one.
He was Chancellor of Germany in the 1980s. He was a head of a NATO country and then Russian money essentially bought him to where he became this lover of Russia. Wanting to get money off gas pipelines.
Then Russia went after public figures. My friends, Steven Segal and Gerard Gephardot. They are Russian citizens. Well, David Duke has an apartment there. They have got three of the separatist movements in the US. The NW Territory separatists, the Texas separatists and this crazy guy who is a Southern secessionist. All of these things are communist. The Soviet Union used to take lackeys and hirelings and bring them over, and make them go on television.
I actually heard a person say, Vladimir Putin is not a communist. Okay. I am a US intelligence officer. I came into the military in 1980. Right in the the mid cold war or the last decade of the cold war, and it was hot. That cold war was very hot.
Everything we were trained in was in identifying KGB operations. I was a Middle East guy. The KGB was everywhere. Get off a boat in Naples, KGB. Go to Cypress, KGB. Do a port visit in Egypt KGB working with Egyptian intelligence. Syria. They were a global threat, but now we have all these people here who are saying. Well, you know. Since 1990, they weren’t communists.
Vladimir Putin, at age 13, according to his own biography, went to a KGB open house and asked them how do I join the KGB. This guy was a career KGB officer, and it was the Soviet Union that collapsed, not his loyalty to communism. The KGB became the FSB. Putin was not the first post-soviet Director of Intelligence. It was disintegrating.
People were literally bringing truckloads of top secret documents to the Americans. So when Putin took over as the director of the FSB. I mean the building. He literally went back to the Lubyanka Prison, the original NKVD KGB headquarters, and resurrected it. Including the furnace in the basement that they throw you into if they catch you as a traitor.
Here’s, the thing about Putin. He reestablished the FSB with all old KGB hands and the only difference was he quintupled their budget every year, and now they have all the technological powers of the west. Here’s the kicker. Right next door was a Greek -I’m sorry, a Russian Orthodox church. That of course had been used for interrogations and abused for over 70 years. This guy renovated it with KGB money and he tied religious orthodoxy to loyalty to the nation in espionage.
John Aravosis:
He’s embraced the sort of populism that the far right here embraced. By becoming anti-Semitic, anti-gay, pro-church, Russian greatness.


Malcolm Nance:
Those are the two arms that brought the right wing to the Russians. The preservation of christianity conferences that Franklin Graham, was leading over there. This stuff was old-school spycraft.
I got one last thing I’ve got to say about that. Look here’s why. I worked at the National Security Agency. There were programs. I swore my life I would die before I would ever open my mouth about them, and this guy’s like no. Screw It. Send it out for the world. Everybody needs to know about this. The little old ladies and old guys at NSA work a thankless job, and they are not “the man.” They are not reading your emails. They don’t have time. These people just want to make sure you don’t get killed.

Snowden Job

Edward Snowden lives in a FSB safe house under FSB protection. His lawyer is a FSB lawyer. He is essentially a defector and I’m not going to say anything about what would motivate Glenn Greenwald. Because who knows, the alt-left and the alt-right are essentially the same thing. This guy spends more time on Fox News, but this is the same person who said MSNBC is working in league with the CIA because Malcolm Nance mistakenly said that Jill Stein had a Russia Today, television program. I later learned she didn’t, but she was on so damn much.
I’ve said this very clearly. There needs to be a new cold war. There is going to be a clash of civilizations here, of ideologies. Between oligarchy and democracy. We thought it would have been communism, but now we find that it’s a rich form of fascism. What did Mussolini call it? He called it a dictatorship of the of the corporate right. Well, here we are. They almost took over our nation.
John Aravosis:
What do you mean? We need to have a cold war? What do you mean?
Malcolm Nance:
I think that there needs to be a strategic confrontation between the ideologies, and that means we have to re-establish all of our allies and make it clear that first off. I am a big proponent of punishing Russia.
You could not take a shot at American democracy openly, by an ex-KGB officer and expect to get away with that. I’ve been advocating this for the last four years.
How To Punish Russia For Their Attack On Democracy
Go around the world and start vacuum cleaning their money up! Look I worked at the National Security Agency. Given the right go ahead to the US Treasury, we could just seize money. If we wanted to. I would take every illicit dollar. I can make sure every one of their mega yachts are impounded or seized by Seal Team Six. All of the Russian oligarchy.CLICK HERE – to get the books and see my other Malcolm Nance interviews

John Aravosis:
Are you saying the oligarchs will put pressure on Putin? Or what do you think will happen?
Malcolm Nance:
As far as I’m concerned, I just want to be paid for the pain that they put this nation through attempting to smash 244 years of democracy. Putin does not allow them to exist without his go-ahead.
He has staff on all of their staffs. He has x-FSB and KGB officers on all of their staffs. They are the ecosystem in which Russia’s richest people stay rich. There’s a way around that. Right and I’m – not joking about seizing all of their mega yachts.
John Aravosis:
But what is the practical impact is that we will show the world?
Malcolm Nance:
The practical impact is that we will show the world that if you come and take a shot at us, there’s going to be hard financial problems. The oligarchs won’t want it to happen again, but there are the people who are going to have to go to Putin and say. Hey, the Americans just took 30 billion dollars from me, or my boat just got seized in Marseilles.
You know what, when you get, every rich person in Russia losing their money. This is the whole reason why Donald Trump is president. He’s a guy who could be bought. He’s a guy who would allow them to play in the world. No sanctions.
I was on an intelligence operation or supported an intelligence operation in which a terrorist was brought onto a yacht off of Cyprus. Little did he know we had seized that yacht and the moment he stepped onto it, he was actually on a commissioned U.S navy warship. Those women with no tops on, who were DEA officers.
You know this guy didn’t know he had screwed up until literally he was being winched onto a US helicopter. Landed onto a US aircraft carrier, then flown non-stop to Andrews Air Force Base. That’s the way we are going to have to play with the people that funded this attack on the United States. Granted, Joe Biden won’t want to do that.
It would take something precipitating for the United States to really go after him, but if somebody were to call me in, and they asked my opinion. I’d say this thing needs to go. We need to go back to 1962 with Russia. We need to start confronting them everywhere.
Hillary Clinton said that. In the runup to the election in 2016, that she would consider Russia’s cyber operations as an act of terrorism, right on par with a major act of terrorism. Of course, a lot of people will say. Well, you’ve got to get a legal basis for this. Russian oligarchs buy American lawyers by the gross now.

They understand if you want to screw with the United States, go into the courts. I would do this. I would work with Congress. If we got a democratic Senate, and I would do what the British did, which is sort of this global magnitsky act and where your unexplained wealth is sizeable.
It’s as simple as that. You come into the United States. We’re going to audit the heck out of you. If you’re tied to global oligarchs and money that came from the liquidation of the Soviet Union, then the US government is going to own itself 4000 apartments in New York City.
John Aravosis:
It is only inevitable that Russia will cross the line again and Biden will be forced to act.
Malcolm Nance:
Look, Russia has crossed the line. What we need to do is. There’s two areas where we need to operate. You can go black or go gray, or you can do it white. I say we start with the black right, whoever the next director of the CIA or the director of national intelligence. I would just make it clear that identifying oligarch assets and all of the personnel that took part in the 2016 information warfare operation on the United States should become global top priorities.
I’d be going full Jason Bourne on them. In the sense that you spool up the whole agency. To say hey, I need full asset coverage on these people and the Treasury Department? I’d have an entire wing of those Justice Department lawyers trace down their funds, issue subpoenas, and say we’re seizing them as assets of an international continuing criminal enterprise. RICO those guys.
John Aravosis:
Oh my God. You can argue for all of us that some of it is vengeance for what they’ve done to us, but the more important part to me is the justice part. It is the looking at we need to prevent this shit in the future. That’s going on right now and if we don’t make it clear that there’s a punishment, a price to be paid for everything they’re doing. I wonder how many members of congress they own at this point.

I would like to know your your opinion on this. There are plenty of folks who have claimed that that Q-anon itself is a Russian op. It’s not just a disinformation op. I don’t know what your thoughts are on that.
Malcolm Nance:
It’s too inherently American. You know, the whole idea. I monitor right-wing extremists online and I read their stuff. I get up at four in the morning. I start reading the morning. My wake up time is 3:30 in the morning, and that means I can go get all my work done before seven in the morning.
When you monitor these people, and you see the crazy that’s, going on around Sydney Powell right now, the Kraken again. This story that Seal Team Six went to Germany to seize the fake voter roll logs from the CIA.
It’s a cartoon movie version of things and the beautiful part is that they were the government. yay America. Rah, rah, rah. Now the government is according to their their own writings, is the enemy now. The deep state right now is taking over an entire election, and is trying to defeat Donald Trump and Trump is fighting them. We now have to get our guns to defeat them.
This is where we delve into craziness, but it’s an indigenous American crazy that’s happening here. Donald Trump, with the amplification of the Russians. Because you know in this election, the Russians didn’t have to do anything. Donald Trump did it all and that amplification took place internally.
So these people have literally the jurassimov doctrine of seizing a nation’s, sovereignty by changing the mindset of a foreign population. To where you are now their savior and ally, has taken place with Donald Trump.

These people are ready to fight, by the way, for the Q-anon stuff. That stuff is so widespread, and this is the premise of my next book. That stuff is so widespread it will become the main ideology of the Republican Party in the next year.

Here’s Why the Right Wing Dominates Talk Radio Today | HuffPost

John Aravosis:
The republicans, though. We talk about this all the time, but think of how many times they talk about how the Russia probe was a hoax and how it proved Trump was innocent. Almost every day they bring this out. Do we just suck at countering this?
Malcolm Nance:
We do. Because we’re normal, rational human beings, with things to do in our life. These people that I monitor in Parlor, Gab, Wemo. All these crazy chat sites are there. They’re nuts. The problem is that nuts is now in the mainstream media and every time. There was one guy.
I saw this in a forum and this one guy goes hey, listen, they certified all these results. It’s a done deal. All we can do is try to support Trump for 2024. immediately. A huge group of people came out and was like you’re a sheeple. You’re, obviously watching the liberal media.
It’s not over by a long shot. You got to watch OANN and I realized. They stay within this echo chamber of theirs in order not to be exposed to the any other reality.
John Aravosis:
Well, it’s worse than that, though. Because a lot of people watch MSNBC, okay and the nightly shows on MSNBC. The nightly shows are liberal right now. There’s a marked difference. Because Rachel and Chris don’t lie. They’ve got a bias. They come from a lefty perspective, but they don’t lie. It’s obviously different.
I was half way joking about, is America like Rwanda. I never thought this stuff would work here. I never thought you could just lie to people and you’d get 47% of the vote. I never thought you could kill 265,000 Americans and you’d get 47% of the vote.

There is nothing these people can’t lie about. There’s nothing they can’t do and then lie about. That 47 of Americans aren’t going to say, ok. Would you call it like a psy-op? Is that what the what right-wing media is?
Malcolm Nance:
It’s not a psy-op. You see, s psy-op requires a targeted, scheduled narrative. Where you know what you’re going to do, and you understand how you’re changing the psychology of it. For the Russians. It was a psychological operation. It was a disinformation operation.
A psychological operation which was carried via the vehicle of disinformation, and that gave you a targeted result which was get Donald Trump elected. Which would benefit the Russian Federation.
This internally, is more like a psych-out. Where disinformation is being used to create a cult-like bubble around these followers in order to go after a targeted result.
An agent of Russia means you have a signed contract. That’s what an actual agent is. Everything below that are useful idiots. Willing assets, unwilling assets, unwitting assets, witting assets, there’s a whole myriad of things there, but back to your question about Is this a psychological operation.
It’s, a psych out operation, where you know people have psyched themselves out, but only because Fox News, the right wing, and Donald Trump have created this bubble of information. The psych out is when they tell you anything outside this bubble is a lie. You are literally watching communist style Kremlin propaganda of Pravda in the Soviet Union being played out with American neo fascism.

Why does it work?

John Aravosis:
Why Does Right Wing Misinformation Work?
Malcolm Nance:
Well, it works because, once you’ve captured the information sphere and you’ve created distrust in the systems that have always given you trustworthy information. You amplify and magnify messages which are pleasing to that target population.
I got in trouble. I was on Bill Maher on the fifth of of November, two days after the election. It was a hard night in Los Angeles, because I stayed up all Thursday night and most of Friday morning to see how it would play out. By Friday afternoon, when I had to go on the show, it’s pretty clear there’s just no way Biden was going to lose. Somebody in the media needs to call it.
So I went on Bill Maher and you know, he was in a sort of a kumbaya mood. Uh, you know, God bless him. He wants us to progress and move forward, but I had to say. These people are racist and they’re straight up racist. They voted for a known white supremacist. They voted for this white tribalism. They voted to cage children. They voted for this talk about apocalyptic rhetoric.
They voted for a Muslim ban and that is an actual function which is identifiable. It’s something that’s quantifiable. It is not a feel-good. I’m just thinking this during this moment. It’s something that I can say you stood up and held a ballot, and marked it, and said I so choose this. So you have positively identified for me where your default is.
CLICK HERE – to get the books and see my other Malcolm Nance interviews
You know, the funny thing is. I’m constantly bringing up parallels to to the radicalization of ISIS members. Which, by the way, was another Tucker Carlson segment where they all went crazy on me. Because I said these convoys that Trumpsters were having, I called them vanilla ISIS convoys. I said these convoys are power projections intended to intimidate and show strength, and you know what, that kind of of electioneering has gone on forever.
When I was a kid they would have a truck with a loud speaker and music and playing around. That’s great. The problem is that in the next year or so, as they get more radicalized and based on what I’m seeing, there’s a lot of mainstream people that are radicalizing. They’re eventually going to start doing those convoys with weapons.
John Aravosis:
Well, I was just going to say there’s a violence to it. A violent undercurrent. Even what went on in Oregon right? They were using their paintball guns, but I mean they were trying to make fun of it.
It’s, just paintball guns. You’re riding by in trucks with what looks like a weapon shooting it at people, which certainly opens you up to being shot back. Somebody doesn’t know it’s a paintball gun, but also a paintball gun?
Malcolm Nance:
Well, you know I operated in and out of Iraq over 10 years as a security and an intelligence contractor there. Where I only worked with Iraqis, which is the smartest thing I ever did. When I was around westerners, man. I was in just mortal terror of a massacre, and there were a lot of shootings that went on in Iraq that culminated with the Blackwater shooting.
They were just the highest level one. I remember one night we were in, Baghdad and somebody saw a shadow and it unleashed 5,000 rounds of ammunition at every shadow in a 360 degrees radius of this hotel that we were protecting. Their mindset is, they’re playing this live action role play world where they’re driving around in special forces technicals, and they’re flying their banners.
Like they’re the the CAG, right? You know, Dev Brewer out in northern Syria and they’re all weapons forward, ready to pounce. You know the stuff that I saw in western private security people over there that I was horrified from and tried to break. When I had 250 British and American private security contractors on my contract. I took them low profile and they were angry, they wanted to be seen they wanted to go to guns.

I see that in these people who, most of whom have never spent a day in the in the military, but they all want to play. They all want to play the super soldiers of Benghazi or they all want to be Black Hawk Down and it’s like are you kidding me? I did that for almost 30 years and believe me. I am more than happy to not have to deal with that here in the United States, but there are many of them.
It’s really a live action, role play or cosplay with real weapons. Those paintball guns are an extension of that. I can’t kill you legally right now, but I can stitch you up. With 25 paintballs or pepper balls legally in dress up games.

They all have this hero worship, but if you guys have ever wondered where the beards and the bro tats and all of the body armor and stuff comes from. It comes from, I can tell you one photograph Delta Force and Seal Team Six protecting Hamid Karzai in like 2003, and that’s, where the guys had the beards and the bro tats and all their weapons forward. No one had seen special forces like this.
So what you’re looking at is this extension of these guys, the vet bros and all the rest of these guys thinking they want to be Seal Team Six. They all want to be special forces operators, and we had lots of these guys in Iraq and and they tried when I was in Libya. They were trying to come into Libya to establish security companies just so they go get some.
I can’t believe these people, what you’re looking at here, are people who are mimicking them. Sort of in the way that people were mimicking John Wayne in the green berets. It’s terrible, but they’re ready to kill people over this. So that they can pose as super soldiers.
It feels to me like, and again I’ve written about the NRA in the past and some of of of the people they encourage to power. It is a powder keg already. Because we’re the only western country that allows anyone of these yahoos to get their hands on an assault rifle, among other things.
They’ve shown up already to events that Shannon Watts and Moms Demand Action have held. Shown up outside with their assault rifles, doing plenty of this stuff where they’re putting themselves in places to threaten people with this weaponry and all it would take is one person shooting and the whole thing could blow up, and you could see you know and a slaughter and to think that this isn’t going to Happen at some point when they’re being encouraged by Fox and Limbaugh and the rest of them.

 

Malcolm Nance:
They view Kyle Rittenhouse as a national hero. The guy got a $2 million bond that’s. $200,000 in cash was put up for him to get out of jail. He is 17 years old. He borrows a gun, he goes someplace where they weren’t invited and he goes out and he starts shooting people because he felt threatened.
You wouldn’t have felt threatened if you hadn’t been out there with a long rifle intimidating people with the intent to kill. These people have been made to think they are the living embodiment of the movie Red Dawn. Like they are the Wolverines.
When you come up against the State, you’re going to find out where the errors of your ways are. You are not going to be greeted by police when you do a hostage barricade like those guys were planning in Wisconsin. To take over the State House and start executing all the Democratic legislators. You’re goning to come up against the FBI Hostage Rescue Team, which is just a civilian way of saying Delta Force. They’re going to come in and show you what professionalism really is. They’re going to treat you like the Taliban or ISIS. Then it’s not going to be fun and games anymore.
It’ll be a massacre, but then we’re going to go back to Ruby Ridge. Back to the late ’90s and now the militias are exploding. This is why I call these people in the new book, TITUS. The Trump Insurgency in the United States. Trump is going to be like the out-of-power Saddam Hussein. He won’t be living in a small hole, but we got his sons Uday and Qusay. These people intend to project political power, destabilize the government, and hopes those followers, without asking him will start a low grade insurgency. Just like Mao Tse Tung’s first phase of revolution.
John Aravosis:
What can we do about it?
Malcolm Nance:
The first thing you’ve got to do about it is we have to re-establish rule of law in the United States. Anytime an incident happens, like with Kyle Rittenhouse, people need to come out with the first words this person broke the law. This person committed murder according to the law. Self defense is when you are at home or you are in a circumstance where people come and they attack you without provocation.
This man went out and started provocation. They went to a car dealership that didn’t invite them, had no idea that they were there, and the police were treating them as friendlies. Actually gave Rittenhouse and them water, and said to them we appreciate what you do. No. We need to say that’s vigilantism.
When you draw that line. Look, I don’t call them domestic terrorists. I wrote the textbook on terrorism, The Terrorist Recognition Handbook. You know what I call them? American terrorists. Just like there are Egyptian terrorists, you have to call them out.
The Proud Boys are right now essentially operating as a street gang. We don’t lighten up on street gangs when they go out and start doing drive by shootings or drug shootings. You gotta start treating them the same way.
They are straddling the line between white and grey by using open carry laws. OK, great. Open carry. I think State legislatures ought to say, you can open carry to your heart’s content, you just can’t carry ammunition on you. You want to carry ammunition? Canceled carry.
These people think that they are in the Wild West. The problem is the West had strict gun control whenever you walked into a village. Most jurisdictions would make you either check your guns or secure your guns. The movies, a lot of that stuff is mythology.
Where you were in danger and needed a gun was where my great great granduncle operated. He was with 9th Calvary buffalo soldiers. The most dangerous place you could be in the West was between towns.
Here’s something that’s interesting. People are constantly going Biden’s coming to take your guns or he’s going to use the National Firearms Act to get a $200 tax to register your guns.
No one is doing that with this current Supreme Court. I wouldn’t be surprised if this Supreme Court eliminates State laws prohibiting the carry of guns. The States will have no right to regulate firearms.
There’s a couple things happening right now that I think help defuse this a little bit. One was the length of the count in the election. Those first four days there were a lot of people spoiling for a fight. As the election wet on, as the counting went on to that Saturday, many had deluded themselves that Trump was going to win.
Saturday was going to be jubilation day. That took the wind out of a lot of sails. Now we’re monitoring these people who are doing more planning for future trouble. Like what happens after January 20th.
A lot of them have this insane belief. That Beto O’Rourke is being put in charge of gun control and they are going to start seizing weapons. Nobody is seizing weapons. There’s a 4th Amendment to the Constitution.
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That would be like saying, I’m going to seize your car. Yes, they can seize your car in certain circumstances, but guess what? Kyle Rittenhouse will never again legally own a firearm. Even if acquitted they would still have a hard time approving him. Things are going to change slowly.
Part of the problem is that these people are deluded in believing that there is a secret plan no matter what they see with their own eyes.
John Aravosis:
A final thing, along these lines. Would you, obviously this gets tougher when it comes to free speech versus sedition, but when you’ve had people actively, in government, arguing for overthrowing our democracy. For ignoring electors.
Would you enforce certain sedition rules? Literally they are calling for armed conflict.
Malcolm Nance:
No that’s different. Armed conflict, I mean. They had a guy at a Proud Boys rally in North Carolina the other day. The guy who was up on the dais wears a T shirt that says Pinochet did nothing wrong. Wears right wing death squad, RWDS patches on his body armor. Encourages people to start reading about how the Argentinians threw people out of helicopters over the ocean to get rid of their bodies.
Well he actually made a statement the other day about how we need to eliminate all the democrats. We need to start the elimination, the mass murder of them. I see that all the time now. It’s part of the Q-anon cannon. The great storm and the great awakening. Where they expect mass arrests, mass incarceration, and mass execution of democrats.
John Aravosis:
So the guy that made that statement, is that sedition?
Malcolm Nance:
Well, it’s not sedition until he starts putting it into practice. Right? You have the right to freedom of speech. It’s when you say, I’m going to start killing people. See there’s a big difference between saying all democrats should be killed. This is where the Justice Department needs to begin referring down too.
We started using the Joint Terrorism Task Force to go against in-cells and kids making threats against schools. They must have rolled up a dozen of them in 2019. Where cops show up at their house, seize all their firearms, arrest them. Well these threats against public order need to be dealt with that way.
The best way to deter them is to start seizing some of their guns in relation to crimes. Because those laws were voted on by their own legislators. You’ve got to take guns from felons. They hate the idea of losing their guns under any circumstances. You want to be an idiot? Keep talking and you’ll lose all your firearms.
I don’t want to stifle free speech but I do want to stop stupid speech that leads to murder or insurrection. You can enforce it but that has to be across the board.
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